The current crisis is an example of political leaders adopting wishful thinking instead of applying the lessons of the past to inform the present and enhance our wisdom. Israel's strong stance in the past has worked in that the Arab states of 1967 and 1973 are no longer belligerent. The same principle is still worthy.
You are engaging in wishful thinking at many levels,please articulate in clear fashion the scenario of how would neutralize Iran. Support from America is not very likely and quite frankly most American Jews are revolted by the religious fascistic settlers on the West Bank and the pograms and subjugation of the Palestinian population. There has been no mention in any blog or by any Israeli since October 7 of the ultimate question.
How can we live in Peace with our Palestinian neighbors. Historically Jews have never had hegemony over Judea Sumaria,,trying to create “facts on the ground” with settlement by arrogant self righteous Orthodox Jews has greatly contributed to Israel’s now very low respectability in the eyes of American Jews and of most Non Jews we live with
You suggest Judea and Samaria, for some unspecified reason, should be Judenrein and label Jews living there “fascistic”. You seem to lack a sense of irony.
“Perhaps this is neither an Eshkol or Golda moment for Israel, but one that is gruelingly, nightmarishly unique.”
I would urge caution applying history to Israel’s present dilemma. The geopolitics of the region have completely changed and the Cold War with the Soviet Communists has ended. Iran under the Shah was moving secular and leaning towards the West. The Egyptian, Syrian, and Jordanian militaries were small, poorly equipped, and inexperienced in modern warfare. Israel was useful to the U.S. in countering Russia’s ambitions in the region and modeling a successful alternative to Communism. The Israeli government made its choice to transition from leftist Kibbutz socialism towards right-wing capitalism. The tactics of asymmetrical warfare to neutralize great power military might were being honed in Vietnam.
Fast forward to the Middle East today with Iran now a radical Islamic theocracy transforming wars of Arab nationalism into radical Islamist holy wars. After the tragic debacles in Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq the world now knows that overwhelming military might is not enough to win ideological wars. The Soviet Union and Communism collapsed and the nascent Russian Federation has regressed into a rogue Mafia state of oligarchs. The Ukrainians have shown that swarms of cheap drones can hobble even Russia’s overwhelming forces. Gaza is a glaring example of the futility of using military force to counter an ideological attack in densely urban areas. Islamist rhetoric has moved martyrdom to the forefront of both Sunni and Shia radical Islamist fervor. A high body count is a feature not a flaw in today’s Middle East. Any symbol of the Western infidel, which Israel has become, must be eradicated from the Holy Land.
No, Israel even with U.S. and EU military support cannot battle its way to victory. Ideological wars are inherently fought in the minds of people, not on physical battlegrounds. Diplomacy is the only way to defuse an ideological war. A preemptive strike against Iran only creates a wounded martyr hell bent on revenge and grueling long term terrorism. Israel must find its place and allies in this struggle of Muslim identity. Judaism had its reformation and Israel was pioneered by secular Jews. Islam is long overdue for a reformation and an alternative ideology to Islamist isolationism. “Lead, follow, or get out of the way.” Genocide and ethnic cleansing are now the only two options. Another choice must be imagined.
While you can’t totally eliminate an ideology, you can decimate a country that is a major proponent of it. Naziism was an ideology that was crushed by the de imation of Germany. This will only end when and if Iran is subjected to such a humiliating defeat, that the people will rise up. However, time is short; Iran is close to having the bomb. Then I don’t have much hope for Israel’s future.
So, what happens to the country you so dispassionately “decimated”? Remember Nazi Germany emerged from that nation decimated after WWI. Islamic fascism emerged from the decimation of the Ottoman Empire after the same World War. Chaos breeds extremism.
Throughout history you've had awful regimes and figures, like Hitler who exploit vulnerablities to sway the masses. The fact is that Germany became a democratic country after Hitler's ouster and rescinded its Nazi past. You will alway have extremists who refuse to take the rational path. Islamism is just another manifestation of the 'glory' days of the Ottoman empire. They want to impose their value system on the West, much like the Ottomans did. The Ottomans occupied vast stretches of Europe, North Africa and Asia. The Islamists of today have a similar vision.
Maybe if the CIA and the Brits had not overthrown a democratically elected government in Iran to put in the Shah things could be different. Maybe if Israel did not indulge in land theft and ethnic cleansing things could be different. Sadly we will never know.
I've been reading articles suggesting Joe Biden's handlers have struck a deal with the Iranians. None of the pieces describe what they're being promised, but the premise is plausible. The ongoing Israeli genocide has torn a rather large hole in the seat of the Democrat's pants. They're losing some of their most militant voters, and they're worried.
That's why Anthony Blinken went way out on a limb this week to declare Netanyahu had agreed to a "bridge to a cease fire", which was immediately and summarily dismissed by Netanyahu. It was a major smackdown which the US media has dutifully ignored.
But the Democrats have to do something. If war breaks out in Lebanon next week, or the week after, the Democrats are cooked, and they know it. AIPAC will be calling in all their markers in Congress and demanding direct action from the US; it would be a nightmare.
I can't say POTATUS' handlers have slipped something under the table to the Mullahs, but I 100% believe they would if they thought it would keep things quiet until the election.
In the meantime, the body count has risen to 40,000 which is more than the US suffered in any war since WWII, combined. If the Israelis manage to wipe out at least 1/2 of the Palestinians they may agree to let the rest escape to somewhere else but until that happens, or they run out of schools to blow up, the slaughter will continue.
Oy Vey! Maybe you are hinting that not only is there no easy answer, but maybe no right one either. It's a mess on steroids. I think not unlike April, Israel has to absorb the attack and work with the US to minimize what it won't be able to minimize. Maybe the only preventative measure is for Israel to announce a 48 hour Ceasefire that can be extended. A step away from either or.
A strike on Iran’s clandestine nuclear sites should be done now, as once Iran has the bomb, it’s too late. Why wait in constant fear of an attack? It drains the resolve of the people waiting for Armageddon when there are other options. I don’t have a lot of confidence in the American Jews solution to the quandary Israel finds itself now, as most never had to fight a war or be in constant fear of one coming. American Jews now have to contend with rising antisemitism here and are quite perplexed as to what to do next. Never mind that antisemitism has been here all along but well camouflaged for a long time, waiting for it to surface sooner or later!! Such is the story of our people and waiting too long for the right time is not an option.!!
First of all, Iran’s nuclear sites are not “clandestine” and would be open to inspections if Trump hadn’t scuttled the UN agreement with Iran.
Secondly, you need to understand Iran’s purpose in getting involved in Israel. Iran could give a damn about the Jews and even less so about the plight of Sunni Palestinians. This is a millennia-old holy war between Arabs and Persians for domination of Islam. Islamic revolutionary Iran wants possession of Jerusalem and the sacred Temple on the Mount.
Israel is a small country about the size of New Jersey. A nuclear strike there will destroy the “Holy Prize” the Shiite radicals covet. If Iran possesses a nuclear weapon, it is more likely to be used against Sunni Muslims than in the Holy Land. Once Iran’s motives are understood then the defense becomes more focused.
This is a Muslim problem seeking a Muslim solution with the Jews caught in the middle of the crossfire. Sunni Arabs and Turks must unite and fight back or end up as rubble like Syria and Lebanon. The West can help by keeping Russia busy in Ukraine and out of the Middle East.
I do completely, totally, 100+% support Israel but like most Americans do not understand at all the "thinking", theology, philosophy, politics of Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran, etc. Would you recommend, at least, one (1) or two (2) essays or books that describe "why" these terrorist Muslims think that they must destroy Israel, and kill any and all Jewish people anywhere, and the people who support them?? Thank you!
Divorce yourself from reliance on the US. I understand that’s difficult but why allow an incompetent, criminal gang of Ivy League thugs hold your country hostage? Israel is valiant and stands as a beacon to us Christian believers. Praise God. Help Israel.
It would be interesting to hear your perspective on the history of the northern border. Hindsight being 20/20, we've gone from full Israeli control beginning in the First Lebanon War and Security Zone (1982-2000), to Barak's unilateral withdrawal (2000), to the destructive yet inconclusive 2nd Lebanon War (2006), to now, Hezbullah essentially attacking the border communities at will.
When has hoping, anticipating or expecting international support during the innumerable threats and attacks Israel has had to confront prior to and throughout its existence seen the light of day. Political leaders in Israel need to be hardwired to this incomprehensible reality. A recent book by Rick Richman "And None Shall Make Them Afraid" -Encounter Books 2023- poignantly brings home this message.
If iran had a nuclear bomb and a delivery system, then yes Israel has the right to a preemptive strike . Otherwise they should be on alert and respond immediately and with lethal force.
The current crisis is an example of political leaders adopting wishful thinking instead of applying the lessons of the past to inform the present and enhance our wisdom. Israel's strong stance in the past has worked in that the Arab states of 1967 and 1973 are no longer belligerent. The same principle is still worthy.
What ever the decision I would not trust this administration. The anti-Semitism and anti-Israel runs deep. My thoughts, attack, attack, attack.
Laughing. Biden has been an Israel First President to the detriment of his country and you think this administration is antisemitic ?
You are engaging in wishful thinking at many levels,please articulate in clear fashion the scenario of how would neutralize Iran. Support from America is not very likely and quite frankly most American Jews are revolted by the religious fascistic settlers on the West Bank and the pograms and subjugation of the Palestinian population. There has been no mention in any blog or by any Israeli since October 7 of the ultimate question.
How can we live in Peace with our Palestinian neighbors. Historically Jews have never had hegemony over Judea Sumaria,,trying to create “facts on the ground” with settlement by arrogant self righteous Orthodox Jews has greatly contributed to Israel’s now very low respectability in the eyes of American Jews and of most Non Jews we live with
The argument about “pograms and subjugation of the Palestinian population” is particularly persuasive.
ROFL! So hard to convey sarcasm in a pithy comment.
You suggest Judea and Samaria, for some unspecified reason, should be Judenrein and label Jews living there “fascistic”. You seem to lack a sense of irony.
Excellent response.
“Perhaps this is neither an Eshkol or Golda moment for Israel, but one that is gruelingly, nightmarishly unique.”
I would urge caution applying history to Israel’s present dilemma. The geopolitics of the region have completely changed and the Cold War with the Soviet Communists has ended. Iran under the Shah was moving secular and leaning towards the West. The Egyptian, Syrian, and Jordanian militaries were small, poorly equipped, and inexperienced in modern warfare. Israel was useful to the U.S. in countering Russia’s ambitions in the region and modeling a successful alternative to Communism. The Israeli government made its choice to transition from leftist Kibbutz socialism towards right-wing capitalism. The tactics of asymmetrical warfare to neutralize great power military might were being honed in Vietnam.
Fast forward to the Middle East today with Iran now a radical Islamic theocracy transforming wars of Arab nationalism into radical Islamist holy wars. After the tragic debacles in Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq the world now knows that overwhelming military might is not enough to win ideological wars. The Soviet Union and Communism collapsed and the nascent Russian Federation has regressed into a rogue Mafia state of oligarchs. The Ukrainians have shown that swarms of cheap drones can hobble even Russia’s overwhelming forces. Gaza is a glaring example of the futility of using military force to counter an ideological attack in densely urban areas. Islamist rhetoric has moved martyrdom to the forefront of both Sunni and Shia radical Islamist fervor. A high body count is a feature not a flaw in today’s Middle East. Any symbol of the Western infidel, which Israel has become, must be eradicated from the Holy Land.
No, Israel even with U.S. and EU military support cannot battle its way to victory. Ideological wars are inherently fought in the minds of people, not on physical battlegrounds. Diplomacy is the only way to defuse an ideological war. A preemptive strike against Iran only creates a wounded martyr hell bent on revenge and grueling long term terrorism. Israel must find its place and allies in this struggle of Muslim identity. Judaism had its reformation and Israel was pioneered by secular Jews. Islam is long overdue for a reformation and an alternative ideology to Islamist isolationism. “Lead, follow, or get out of the way.” Genocide and ethnic cleansing are now the only two options. Another choice must be imagined.
While you can’t totally eliminate an ideology, you can decimate a country that is a major proponent of it. Naziism was an ideology that was crushed by the de imation of Germany. This will only end when and if Iran is subjected to such a humiliating defeat, that the people will rise up. However, time is short; Iran is close to having the bomb. Then I don’t have much hope for Israel’s future.
The ship has sailed.
So, what happens to the country you so dispassionately “decimated”? Remember Nazi Germany emerged from that nation decimated after WWI. Islamic fascism emerged from the decimation of the Ottoman Empire after the same World War. Chaos breeds extremism.
Throughout history you've had awful regimes and figures, like Hitler who exploit vulnerablities to sway the masses. The fact is that Germany became a democratic country after Hitler's ouster and rescinded its Nazi past. You will alway have extremists who refuse to take the rational path. Islamism is just another manifestation of the 'glory' days of the Ottoman empire. They want to impose their value system on the West, much like the Ottomans did. The Ottomans occupied vast stretches of Europe, North Africa and Asia. The Islamists of today have a similar vision.
I repeat, chaos breeds extremism. A decimated Iran will be “rescued” by Russia and China - not exactly friends of the West.
Maybe if the CIA and the Brits had not overthrown a democratically elected government in Iran to put in the Shah things could be different. Maybe if Israel did not indulge in land theft and ethnic cleansing things could be different. Sadly we will never know.
I've been reading articles suggesting Joe Biden's handlers have struck a deal with the Iranians. None of the pieces describe what they're being promised, but the premise is plausible. The ongoing Israeli genocide has torn a rather large hole in the seat of the Democrat's pants. They're losing some of their most militant voters, and they're worried.
That's why Anthony Blinken went way out on a limb this week to declare Netanyahu had agreed to a "bridge to a cease fire", which was immediately and summarily dismissed by Netanyahu. It was a major smackdown which the US media has dutifully ignored.
But the Democrats have to do something. If war breaks out in Lebanon next week, or the week after, the Democrats are cooked, and they know it. AIPAC will be calling in all their markers in Congress and demanding direct action from the US; it would be a nightmare.
I can't say POTATUS' handlers have slipped something under the table to the Mullahs, but I 100% believe they would if they thought it would keep things quiet until the election.
In the meantime, the body count has risen to 40,000 which is more than the US suffered in any war since WWII, combined. If the Israelis manage to wipe out at least 1/2 of the Palestinians they may agree to let the rest escape to somewhere else but until that happens, or they run out of schools to blow up, the slaughter will continue.
Oy Vey! Maybe you are hinting that not only is there no easy answer, but maybe no right one either. It's a mess on steroids. I think not unlike April, Israel has to absorb the attack and work with the US to minimize what it won't be able to minimize. Maybe the only preventative measure is for Israel to announce a 48 hour Ceasefire that can be extended. A step away from either or.
America in 1973 advised israel not to attack - the same Biden dems d from Israel, I don’t think it’s Netanyahu
You didn't say what you think Bibi should do.
A strike on Iran’s clandestine nuclear sites should be done now, as once Iran has the bomb, it’s too late. Why wait in constant fear of an attack? It drains the resolve of the people waiting for Armageddon when there are other options. I don’t have a lot of confidence in the American Jews solution to the quandary Israel finds itself now, as most never had to fight a war or be in constant fear of one coming. American Jews now have to contend with rising antisemitism here and are quite perplexed as to what to do next. Never mind that antisemitism has been here all along but well camouflaged for a long time, waiting for it to surface sooner or later!! Such is the story of our people and waiting too long for the right time is not an option.!!
Seems to me that is Israel can have the bomb Iran can too.
First of all, Iran’s nuclear sites are not “clandestine” and would be open to inspections if Trump hadn’t scuttled the UN agreement with Iran.
Secondly, you need to understand Iran’s purpose in getting involved in Israel. Iran could give a damn about the Jews and even less so about the plight of Sunni Palestinians. This is a millennia-old holy war between Arabs and Persians for domination of Islam. Islamic revolutionary Iran wants possession of Jerusalem and the sacred Temple on the Mount.
Israel is a small country about the size of New Jersey. A nuclear strike there will destroy the “Holy Prize” the Shiite radicals covet. If Iran possesses a nuclear weapon, it is more likely to be used against Sunni Muslims than in the Holy Land. Once Iran’s motives are understood then the defense becomes more focused.
This is a Muslim problem seeking a Muslim solution with the Jews caught in the middle of the crossfire. Sunni Arabs and Turks must unite and fight back or end up as rubble like Syria and Lebanon. The West can help by keeping Russia busy in Ukraine and out of the Middle East.
https://johnhardman.substack.com/p/israel-iran-war-second-nekba
Good evening, Mr. Oren,
I do completely, totally, 100+% support Israel but like most Americans do not understand at all the "thinking", theology, philosophy, politics of Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran, etc. Would you recommend, at least, one (1) or two (2) essays or books that describe "why" these terrorist Muslims think that they must destroy Israel, and kill any and all Jewish people anywhere, and the people who support them?? Thank you!
Yours truly,
Doug Olson
Good question. This is what my research found… https://johnhardman.substack.com/p/hitlers-grand-mufti
Divorce yourself from reliance on the US. I understand that’s difficult but why allow an incompetent, criminal gang of Ivy League thugs hold your country hostage? Israel is valiant and stands as a beacon to us Christian believers. Praise God. Help Israel.
Israel is moving to improve its defense industry capacity.
It would be interesting to hear your perspective on the history of the northern border. Hindsight being 20/20, we've gone from full Israeli control beginning in the First Lebanon War and Security Zone (1982-2000), to Barak's unilateral withdrawal (2000), to the destructive yet inconclusive 2nd Lebanon War (2006), to now, Hezbullah essentially attacking the border communities at will.
When has hoping, anticipating or expecting international support during the innumerable threats and attacks Israel has had to confront prior to and throughout its existence seen the light of day. Political leaders in Israel need to be hardwired to this incomprehensible reality. A recent book by Rick Richman "And None Shall Make Them Afraid" -Encounter Books 2023- poignantly brings home this message.
First?
Didn’t Iran/Hamas already strike?
Too late at this point
Although with iran, the collapse of Iran is so much easier to achieve by doing nothing. Or nothing overt.
Let the group killing Iranian leaders just keep doing what they are doing.
https://marlowe1.substack.com/p/job-chapter-18
If iran had a nuclear bomb and a delivery system, then yes Israel has the right to a preemptive strike . Otherwise they should be on alert and respond immediately and with lethal force.