I think we all knew Trump would cave. Americans want their gas. Period. And the political machine wants its midterms. We’ve now essentially told the world’s Islamists the West is too ‘progressive’ and weak to play the long game. It’s all immediate gratification for us. That is, and will be, our demise.
I didn't. in fact, I assured my Hasidic daughter and son-in-law that Trump would never abandon Israel.
to say I am disappointed in him is an understatement.
the one ray of hope I cling to is that Vance is announcing all this stuff, not Rubio. in my mind, I like to think that Rubio said "no thanks, I'm not gonna be the one to crow about our betraying Israel, not to mention the brave Iranian people who we promised to help."
Or reduce the regulations on production. Or make thecase o Americans that the cost of a temporary (but not brief) price hike pales in comparison to the enormous benefit of riding the world of the Iranian flavor of Islamofascism. Trump is a poor leader. Unfortunately for Israel most of the alternatives are worse. A
Trump is a huge disappointment not just to Israel but to the many millions of Americans supporting Israel. When will Israel learn they cannot depend on other countries for their security?
Blame it on the Jews. Blame it on Israel. Blame it on Bibi. So many people flip out when Jews defend themselves. This is why Bibi is hated and demonized. He’s a true defender of the Jewish people.
The biggest and most significant difference between the US and Iran is that Iranian leaders do not care about public opinion. They simply kill anyone and everyone who opposes them. The don't care about civilian losses, and enough money to spend on defense. They also are experts in managing their enemies, as they've been a major player in the region for over 1000 years. It's an absurd black noir comedy for Trump to believe he could out-maneuver the Iranians. In the US, public opinion is a major influence, and the government (whoever is in charge) consults it constantly.
As a Trump supporter, I can say that Trump is as weak as Obama and Carter.. well unless… we end up going back to Combat after this 60 day period is up. Will have to await the language of this forthcoming MOU and another 60 day period of wait and see!
While I’m pissed about the deal, also… he had his knee on their throat… but, not nearly as weak as Carter or BHO. We need to remember, there was much success in this military mission. Didn’t account for the Strait of Hormuz. Still, between what the US and Israel did early in the war was pretty impressive. The mistake was stopping.
All for a used 747 and the dangled promise of a Nobel Prize that the Committee wouldn’t award to Trump if he cured cancer and found the Lindbergh baby.
RE: Netanyahu’s friendship with Trump seemed deep and unbreakable, surpassing that between Yitzhak Rabin and Bill Clinton, perhaps even between Roosevelt and Churchill.
This statement betrays a woeful ignorance of who Trump is and how he operates. Bibi and Israel are learning that painful, costly lesson at the worst possible time — but being a supposedly canny pol, Bibi should’ve figured that out a long time ago.
Israel has been at war with Iran since 1979 - a war that will continue for many years. Israel is in a far better strategic position than ever and will continue to get stronger faster than its enemies. Trump's actions shouldn't surprise anyone who has been paying attention for the last 10 years.
What’s the question?? Trump is temporary, Israel is here to forever! Take care of yourselves, resolve your internal problems and take out Hezbollah for now!!!!
It would begin by emphasizing responsible and ethical governance, maximizing efficiency and unity of purpose. This means removing all non/antiZionist elements from positions of influence from which they hold the whole country ransom.
When Netanyahu is so beholden to his coalition partners that he dare not act against these corrosive elements, the government is paralyzed.
Since the current government has allowed itself to be boxed into a corner by relying too heavily on the mercurial Americans, thereby eliminating its ability to aggressively act offensively against the genocidal threat, the only way forward at this present time is to make it quite clear to the Lebanese that the entire south of Lebanon will remain depopulated from its million plus Shiite inhabitants until they decide to take responsibility for the malignancy they have allowed to flourish in their midst. Then make sure the entire region is cleansed of all weapons and tunnels. And lastly saturate the land and skies with drones to monitor every inch.
Israeli lives are always in peril and have been for over 100 years. Yet it is still preferable to the 2000 years of being helpless and stateless, cowering under the boot.
As an American I can say this: anyone who thought Trump was reliable and could be trusted is an absolute moron. There’s a reason I never voted for him. And maybe Bibi shouldn’t have gone out of his way to alienate the Democratic Party and the vast majority of American Jews, including Zionists like me. Why the hell did he ever think that would turn out well?
He didn't alienate Democrats. They have hated him since the 90's. Democrats were always going to turn anti-Zionist and it will continue no matter who runs Israel.
He sure seemed supportive immediately after October 7. He even rushed to Israel in person, during a war. I think he would’ve been even more so had it not been an election year and his left flank so oppositional.
He was supportive. He just thought Bibi went too far, and not only Bibi. Smotrich and Ben Gvir were talking about pushing out every person in Gaza. That was never going to go over well even if the sentiment was understandable I also think it’s hard for non Jews to totally get it. I have family in Israel and was there visiting just a month before it happened, so for my husband and I it was a visceral gut punch. It’s not the same for outsiders of any stripe.
You’re wrong. He alienated us when he behaved so badly to Obama and to John Kerry, and when he accepted the GOP invite to speak to congress over Obama’s objections. When you publicly diss a sitting president, that president’s party is going to get PISSED. And when that party represents 75% of American Jews, it’s also flat out stupid.
No, he wasn’t. Not wanting a war doesn’t make him pro-Iran. He wanted to stop the nuclear weapons program; and right now, his deal looks pretty damn good. Look what Trump brought on us all by blowing it up. Iran in control of the strait, the Revolutionary Guards openly in charge of the country and killing their own people, and our allies in the region furious at us because they’re being bombed. Yeah, great.
You are in such denial. Jews like you in my family infuriate me. You still think Obama was a good guy and friend. Your liberal madness outweighs your Yiddisha Kup
I think Obama was better than Trump. And for Americans, he was better. Even for Israel he’s looking better than Trump, given Trump’s incompetence. Trump is purely transactional and cares nothing for human life or for anything outside of his family.
I agree that Trump is transactional, however with BHO, between his Muslim upbringing and his close advisor, Valerie Jarrett, he was much more sympathetic to the Mullahs than Trump. But, this argument is now moot. We have what we have.
Trump was the only president who actually did something about Iran's nuclear threat. That said, the mid terms, and the lack of support for from the American public squashed the effort. "It's the economy, stupid" quipped James Carville the Democrat strategiest during Bill Clinton's successful 1992 presidential campaign against incumbent George H.W. Bush.
I think I heard it on Dan Senor’s ‘Call me back’ podcast someone surmised that Trump would shut things down for the World Cup, get through the summer with cheaper gas, weather the midterms hopefully less scathed and then have the option to go full bore again after some time to replenish arms, observe Iran’s reactions etc. If only this current ceasefire were a big ruse leading to the final blow to the throat of Iran to rescue the world from a religious idiocracy, the Iranian people from subjugation, and Israel from its largest foe. May it be that Trump not Chicken Out and finish this Iranian fiasco of 50 years.
I think we all knew Trump would cave. Americans want their gas. Period. And the political machine wants its midterms. We’ve now essentially told the world’s Islamists the West is too ‘progressive’ and weak to play the long game. It’s all immediate gratification for us. That is, and will be, our demise.
I didn't. in fact, I assured my Hasidic daughter and son-in-law that Trump would never abandon Israel.
to say I am disappointed in him is an understatement.
the one ray of hope I cling to is that Vance is announcing all this stuff, not Rubio. in my mind, I like to think that Rubio said "no thanks, I'm not gonna be the one to crow about our betraying Israel, not to mention the brave Iranian people who we promised to help."
You do know we are the largest Exporter of petroleum. We have our own gas.
Yes, but we want it for cheap, which is why we constantly obsess and whine about the price, instead of figuring out how to use less of it.
Or reduce the regulations on production. Or make thecase o Americans that the cost of a temporary (but not brief) price hike pales in comparison to the enormous benefit of riding the world of the Iranian flavor of Islamofascism. Trump is a poor leader. Unfortunately for Israel most of the alternatives are worse. A
You’re so right.
I remember 23 years ago when you dingbats were assuring me that it was all about the oil.
What changed your mind for the eleventeenth time?
This should not be a surprise. Netenyahu “encouraged “ Trump and he took the bait but he is what he is and this should not be a surprise
Trump is a huge disappointment not just to Israel but to the many millions of Americans supporting Israel. When will Israel learn they cannot depend on other countries for their security?
From one Sheldon to another, ditto that
Blame it on the Jews. Blame it on Israel. Blame it on Bibi. So many people flip out when Jews defend themselves. This is why Bibi is hated and demonized. He’s a true defender of the Jewish people.
Time for Bibi to show Israel and the world what a true leader of the Jewish state will do.
Spectacle- excellent word choice. I hoped for something real, but in my heart I expected it to end in tears.
The biggest and most significant difference between the US and Iran is that Iranian leaders do not care about public opinion. They simply kill anyone and everyone who opposes them. The don't care about civilian losses, and enough money to spend on defense. They also are experts in managing their enemies, as they've been a major player in the region for over 1000 years. It's an absurd black noir comedy for Trump to believe he could out-maneuver the Iranians. In the US, public opinion is a major influence, and the government (whoever is in charge) consults it constantly.
As a Trump supporter, I can say that Trump is as weak as Obama and Carter.. well unless… we end up going back to Combat after this 60 day period is up. Will have to await the language of this forthcoming MOU and another 60 day period of wait and see!
Just like Hamas gave up its weapons
Trump loves the headlines and hopes that not too many people can see through the BS! In this case, many of us see the BS!
Correct
I think there is a better likelihood of Jill Biden being elected president than Trump going back to combat.
Do you really think that’s likely? Hardly!
Agree… not very likely
While I’m pissed about the deal, also… he had his knee on their throat… but, not nearly as weak as Carter or BHO. We need to remember, there was much success in this military mission. Didn’t account for the Strait of Hormuz. Still, between what the US and Israel did early in the war was pretty impressive. The mistake was stopping.
not as weak as Obama? Trump just negotiated JCPOA 2.0. main difference is it subsets in 15 years instead of 10. it's a shonda fur die goyim
Yeah, I hear ya’. At least Trump and Israel kicked some ass before capitulating. BHO kissed ass before capitulating. Small diff.
Yes, there was some ass-kicking at the outset … but, it will all be irrelevant if we give Iran billions of dollars simply to start all over.
All for a used 747 and the dangled promise of a Nobel Prize that the Committee wouldn’t award to Trump if he cured cancer and found the Lindbergh baby.
Very disappointed in President Trump.
RE: Netanyahu’s friendship with Trump seemed deep and unbreakable, surpassing that between Yitzhak Rabin and Bill Clinton, perhaps even between Roosevelt and Churchill.
This statement betrays a woeful ignorance of who Trump is and how he operates. Bibi and Israel are learning that painful, costly lesson at the worst possible time — but being a supposedly canny pol, Bibi should’ve figured that out a long time ago.
Bibi appears to have made a terrible mistake trusting Trump.
Israel has been at war with Iran since 1979 - a war that will continue for many years. Israel is in a far better strategic position than ever and will continue to get stronger faster than its enemies. Trump's actions shouldn't surprise anyone who has been paying attention for the last 10 years.
What’s the question?? Trump is temporary, Israel is here to forever! Take care of yourselves, resolve your internal problems and take out Hezbollah for now!!!!
Infuriating. Thank you @Michael Oren for another great piece.
We must do all these things. But as Michael Oren knows full well, they are all impossible with the current government.
What do you think an alternative (hypothetical) government would do? What are the choices?
It would begin by emphasizing responsible and ethical governance, maximizing efficiency and unity of purpose. This means removing all non/antiZionist elements from positions of influence from which they hold the whole country ransom.
When Netanyahu is so beholden to his coalition partners that he dare not act against these corrosive elements, the government is paralyzed.
I meant tactics against Hezbollah, specifically.
Since the current government has allowed itself to be boxed into a corner by relying too heavily on the mercurial Americans, thereby eliminating its ability to aggressively act offensively against the genocidal threat, the only way forward at this present time is to make it quite clear to the Lebanese that the entire south of Lebanon will remain depopulated from its million plus Shiite inhabitants until they decide to take responsibility for the malignancy they have allowed to flourish in their midst. Then make sure the entire region is cleansed of all weapons and tunnels. And lastly saturate the land and skies with drones to monitor every inch.
Sadly, either choice puts Israeli lives in peril, unless something drastic happens.
Israeli lives are always in peril and have been for over 100 years. Yet it is still preferable to the 2000 years of being helpless and stateless, cowering under the boot.
As an American I can say this: anyone who thought Trump was reliable and could be trusted is an absolute moron. There’s a reason I never voted for him. And maybe Bibi shouldn’t have gone out of his way to alienate the Democratic Party and the vast majority of American Jews, including Zionists like me. Why the hell did he ever think that would turn out well?
He didn't alienate Democrats. They have hated him since the 90's. Democrats were always going to turn anti-Zionist and it will continue no matter who runs Israel.
Agree… since Menachem Begin lectured Senator Biden in 1982. Biden never was particularly supportive of Israel.
He sure seemed supportive immediately after October 7. He even rushed to Israel in person, during a war. I think he would’ve been even more so had it not been an election year and his left flank so oppositional.
He was supportive. He just thought Bibi went too far, and not only Bibi. Smotrich and Ben Gvir were talking about pushing out every person in Gaza. That was never going to go over well even if the sentiment was understandable I also think it’s hard for non Jews to totally get it. I have family in Israel and was there visiting just a month before it happened, so for my husband and I it was a visceral gut punch. It’s not the same for outsiders of any stripe.
Interesting. And no one has drawn the conclusion that foreigners lecturing American politicians doesn’t end well?
You’re wrong. He alienated us when he behaved so badly to Obama and to John Kerry, and when he accepted the GOP invite to speak to congress over Obama’s objections. When you publicly diss a sitting president, that president’s party is going to get PISSED. And when that party represents 75% of American Jews, it’s also flat out stupid.
was that before or after Obama invited Bibi to the WH and then huffily said "I'm going to have dinner with my family" and left him sitting there?
Bibi didn't alienate the Dems. they alienated themselves. Obama was pro-Iran from the get-go.
No, he wasn’t. Not wanting a war doesn’t make him pro-Iran. He wanted to stop the nuclear weapons program; and right now, his deal looks pretty damn good. Look what Trump brought on us all by blowing it up. Iran in control of the strait, the Revolutionary Guards openly in charge of the country and killing their own people, and our allies in the region furious at us because they’re being bombed. Yeah, great.
You are in such denial. Jews like you in my family infuriate me. You still think Obama was a good guy and friend. Your liberal madness outweighs your Yiddisha Kup
100%! They live in the lala land, such "liberals."
I think Obama was better than Trump. And for Americans, he was better. Even for Israel he’s looking better than Trump, given Trump’s incompetence. Trump is purely transactional and cares nothing for human life or for anything outside of his family.
I agree that Trump is transactional, however with BHO, between his Muslim upbringing and his close advisor, Valerie Jarrett, he was much more sympathetic to the Mullahs than Trump. But, this argument is now moot. We have what we have.
What we have is a mess.
Trump was the only president who actually did something about Iran's nuclear threat. That said, the mid terms, and the lack of support for from the American public squashed the effort. "It's the economy, stupid" quipped James Carville the Democrat strategiest during Bill Clinton's successful 1992 presidential campaign against incumbent George H.W. Bush.
I think I heard it on Dan Senor’s ‘Call me back’ podcast someone surmised that Trump would shut things down for the World Cup, get through the summer with cheaper gas, weather the midterms hopefully less scathed and then have the option to go full bore again after some time to replenish arms, observe Iran’s reactions etc. If only this current ceasefire were a big ruse leading to the final blow to the throat of Iran to rescue the world from a religious idiocracy, the Iranian people from subjugation, and Israel from its largest foe. May it be that Trump not Chicken Out and finish this Iranian fiasco of 50 years.
Possible, I heard it from Call Me Back too, but the likelihood is rather slim
I knew you couldn't trust Trump. You see malignant narcissists only have one loyalty, and that's to themselves. He's thrown Israel under the bus.
There will be a fake 'peace' deal just like in Gaza. Did Hamas disarm? Big joke.
Just wait until Trump and his MAGA base are starting to blame “the Jews” for tricking the president into the war, because that will come next.
If that isn't the case, why are "the Jews" blaming him? what for?
Well, most of us knew it but hoped he would act quickly enough not to get stuck in the current quagmire