As Israel gets ready to respond to any US-Iran deal, now is the time to enter into an intimate discussion with the White House about protecting our future security.
I believe the very act of publicly going to Washington to seek a promise for Israel's future security is a mistake. Now is the time for Israel to make sure all enemies undertstand that its security will NOT be defined by Washington whether the president is the friendly Trump or an unfriendly Democrat in the future.
I only disagree with the word “security”. The US has never put boots on the ground to assist Israel. And, in Iran, the Israelis are definitely a partnership. Frankly, the IDF did a lot of the heavy lifting.
No, Israel is dependent on the weapons. And, that’s changing.
As usual, Michael, proactive thinking/planning. Hopefully the Israeli government is thinking along similar lines. And your comment about Obama and the Golan- just another example of his lack of understanding about the Middle East, among other things, and his administration’s feckless policies that contributed to where we are now with Iran and its proxies.
Wish I trusted Trump's integrity, or lack there of. Israel's goal to topple the regime has not occurred. This would mean more insider involvement. US has helped to weaken their military prowess, but what next? A deal is imminent, but has the goal been achieved as well, to topple their ability for nuclear bombs. There must be an aggressive internal rebellion or things will just go back to Iranian Regime lies and killings. And in time they will return with greater force. Sadly, though many of the surrounding Muslim countries support Iran's downfall, none have come forward to help. The Iranian regime, proxy power, dissemination of their proxies and Qatar dollars is still winning out. What has been accomplishe?
While Amb Oren correctly recalls the requests made to Obama, what he leaves out is the blunder mistake BN made coming to the US Congress without having given notice to Obama (as a matter of diplomatic protocol)!! Even Oren admits this in his wonderful book of the period…So long as BN believes he is the ‘tail wagging the dog’ no good will come about.
In the end, Trump will screw over Israel just as surely as he's screwing over America. Whatever the final accord reached with Iran might be, it will magnitudes less than promised. Trump is a lying narcissist who can't see past his own ego. That you can count on.
Mr. Oren,, "from your mouth to G-d's ears"! And I am not referring to President Trump and co. Your thinking is concise, clear and necessary to me. But I do not believe that in the here and now with mid-terms and the current progressive excuse for the Democratic party and the MAGA Republican party Israel will be able to realize few, if any, of the strategies you suggest. I definitely hope it is otherwise! Am Israel Chai!
There’s not much political appetite to furnish Israel advanced weaponry. In any case, Israel needs to become more independent and less reliant on U.S. military assistance for the good of both countries.
I’m a Zionist. But it is time for Israel to go it alone. If it wants to buy military equipment it must be at full price. And get in line with everyone else. Until they get in line with American interests, forget what Trump thinks they are, but two states are what is American interests. This is Rahm Emmanuel’s position.
It is a bit gob smacking that Oren, a Bibi sycophant, is pushing for an alliance. He and his crew I would freeze out. I would not even talk to them about a defense pact. Promote people who are aligned with US interests.
How to deliver a nuclear weapon is a topic that has not been full discussed. It might be possible that by a land-based delivery, by a disguised vehicle or carried on a small ship too. Of course the effects of an explosion at ground-level will not be so strong as if it were in the air at a few thousand feet, but it will still be very deadly. I hope that our armed forces are aware of this possibility, even with what Iran has left of its previous incompleted developments, for it to be possible or even without the explosion, to spread radioactive material on us as if it were poison.
"Donald Trump is certainly not Obama. If he is indeed headed for a deal with Iran, he is still mindful of Israel’s security. Now, then, is the time to engage in an intimate dialogue with the administration."
It is Congress that holds the ultimate power of declaring war and financing it. The Israeli-initiated Iran War is not popular in the U.S., nor with any of our allies in Europe and the Middle East. Netanyahu made the previous blunder of bypassing the Obama administration and pandering directly to Republican conservatives in his address to Congress. Bibi got his ass handed to him, and all proposals were rejected.
Fast forward to today, and Netanyahu and Trump, knowing they could not get Congressional approval for unilateral attacks on Iran without support from GSCC allies, this time flagrantly bypassed Congress and local allies, and launched an illegal, unprovoked attack that quickly spread to all the Gulf States and now worldwide.
The word "intimate" carries a big load here. This situation is no longer an intimate unilateral action between Israel, the U.S., and Iran. It is now a regional conflagration with critical international economic consequences. Any "intimacy" has long since evaporated, and the geopolitical dynamics of the entire Middle East and the world are affected. Spotlights are flooding every action Israel and the U.S. take, and both countries now live in a fishbowl.
Both Netanyahu and Trump are on the ropes and fighting for political legitimacy in their respective countries. I sincerely doubt there will be any serious discussion of mutual security other than individual survival. Narcissists don't do "intimacy" except as a transactional self-serving deal, and neither party has anything left to offer the other. As the anxiety and economic pain increase, the world will look for a scapegoat, and you can bet Trump will offer up Netanyahu on a platter. Any pretense of Israel as a "bastion of democracy" has been cruelly squandered by both parties. A reckoning is nigh.
The entire piece is about Israeli strategic interests, not Trump’s personal interests. The “intimate dialogue” is presented as a tool for Israel to obtain security guarantees and military capabilities from the United States. As always, you inject everything with everything you hate about Israel, Netanyahu, and Trump.
The chance of Israel getting any security guarantees from the U.S. or the EU currently is nil. Israel has chosen the stance of the lone wolf pariah nation, and internal dialogue is about Israel delinking from U.S. military aid. The sentiment here in the U.S. concurs.
"A major survey by The New York Times and Siena University reveals growing American opposition to military aid for Israel and military action against Iran. Only 30 percent support war with Iran, while 64 percent oppose it. Most respondents also reject continued US military aid to Israel." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC2q12bBji4
As I mentioned in my post, there is no "intimacy" left between the U.S. and Israel. This is not about my feelings, but about the sentiment of the majority of the American public, especially among younger voters. Wishing it were different is probably not a viable plan forward.
"A pariah is an outcast or someone who is universally despised, avoided, or rejected by society or a specific group. It usually describes a person (nation) who has been shunned due to a scandal, an offense, or a failure to meet community standards."
B2? Once again I assume you mean B21. There are only 19 B2s, the youngest 30 years old, and all due to be replaced by B21s, of which the US plans to build 150 at least, all capable of dropping the Massive Ordnance Ground Penetrating Bomb,
I believe the very act of publicly going to Washington to seek a promise for Israel's future security is a mistake. Now is the time for Israel to make sure all enemies undertstand that its security will NOT be defined by Washington whether the president is the friendly Trump or an unfriendly Democrat in the future.
Maybe… not a bad take at all… however, that message still needs to be communicated and face to face is best.
I don't oppose any face to face meeting. But the thematic and optics matter.
Israel is too dependent on the US for security. We already see what’s happening in the democrat party.
I only disagree with the word “security”. The US has never put boots on the ground to assist Israel. And, in Iran, the Israelis are definitely a partnership. Frankly, the IDF did a lot of the heavy lifting.
No, Israel is dependent on the weapons. And, that’s changing.
As usual, Michael, proactive thinking/planning. Hopefully the Israeli government is thinking along similar lines. And your comment about Obama and the Golan- just another example of his lack of understanding about the Middle East, among other things, and his administration’s feckless policies that contributed to where we are now with Iran and its proxies.
Wish I trusted Trump's integrity, or lack there of. Israel's goal to topple the regime has not occurred. This would mean more insider involvement. US has helped to weaken their military prowess, but what next? A deal is imminent, but has the goal been achieved as well, to topple their ability for nuclear bombs. There must be an aggressive internal rebellion or things will just go back to Iranian Regime lies and killings. And in time they will return with greater force. Sadly, though many of the surrounding Muslim countries support Iran's downfall, none have come forward to help. The Iranian regime, proxy power, dissemination of their proxies and Qatar dollars is still winning out. What has been accomplishe?
Amazing article as usual.
Trump would sell out his mother for $10. If Israel hasn't planned for Trump to throw them under the bus, it's the day before 10/7.
While Amb Oren correctly recalls the requests made to Obama, what he leaves out is the blunder mistake BN made coming to the US Congress without having given notice to Obama (as a matter of diplomatic protocol)!! Even Oren admits this in his wonderful book of the period…So long as BN believes he is the ‘tail wagging the dog’ no good will come about.
In the end, Trump will screw over Israel just as surely as he's screwing over America. Whatever the final accord reached with Iran might be, it will magnitudes less than promised. Trump is a lying narcissist who can't see past his own ego. That you can count on.
Didn’t Trump already recognize Israel sovereignty over golan heights? Isn’t there a trump heights subdivision there?
Yes
Mr. Oren,, "from your mouth to G-d's ears"! And I am not referring to President Trump and co. Your thinking is concise, clear and necessary to me. But I do not believe that in the here and now with mid-terms and the current progressive excuse for the Democratic party and the MAGA Republican party Israel will be able to realize few, if any, of the strategies you suggest. I definitely hope it is otherwise! Am Israel Chai!
There’s not much political appetite to furnish Israel advanced weaponry. In any case, Israel needs to become more independent and less reliant on U.S. military assistance for the good of both countries.
I’m a Zionist. But it is time for Israel to go it alone. If it wants to buy military equipment it must be at full price. And get in line with everyone else. Until they get in line with American interests, forget what Trump thinks they are, but two states are what is American interests. This is Rahm Emmanuel’s position.
It is a bit gob smacking that Oren, a Bibi sycophant, is pushing for an alliance. He and his crew I would freeze out. I would not even talk to them about a defense pact. Promote people who are aligned with US interests.
How to deliver a nuclear weapon is a topic that has not been full discussed. It might be possible that by a land-based delivery, by a disguised vehicle or carried on a small ship too. Of course the effects of an explosion at ground-level will not be so strong as if it were in the air at a few thousand feet, but it will still be very deadly. I hope that our armed forces are aware of this possibility, even with what Iran has left of its previous incompleted developments, for it to be possible or even without the explosion, to spread radioactive material on us as if it were poison.
"Donald Trump is certainly not Obama. If he is indeed headed for a deal with Iran, he is still mindful of Israel’s security. Now, then, is the time to engage in an intimate dialogue with the administration."
It is Congress that holds the ultimate power of declaring war and financing it. The Israeli-initiated Iran War is not popular in the U.S., nor with any of our allies in Europe and the Middle East. Netanyahu made the previous blunder of bypassing the Obama administration and pandering directly to Republican conservatives in his address to Congress. Bibi got his ass handed to him, and all proposals were rejected.
Fast forward to today, and Netanyahu and Trump, knowing they could not get Congressional approval for unilateral attacks on Iran without support from GSCC allies, this time flagrantly bypassed Congress and local allies, and launched an illegal, unprovoked attack that quickly spread to all the Gulf States and now worldwide.
The word "intimate" carries a big load here. This situation is no longer an intimate unilateral action between Israel, the U.S., and Iran. It is now a regional conflagration with critical international economic consequences. Any "intimacy" has long since evaporated, and the geopolitical dynamics of the entire Middle East and the world are affected. Spotlights are flooding every action Israel and the U.S. take, and both countries now live in a fishbowl.
Both Netanyahu and Trump are on the ropes and fighting for political legitimacy in their respective countries. I sincerely doubt there will be any serious discussion of mutual security other than individual survival. Narcissists don't do "intimacy" except as a transactional self-serving deal, and neither party has anything left to offer the other. As the anxiety and economic pain increase, the world will look for a scapegoat, and you can bet Trump will offer up Netanyahu on a platter. Any pretense of Israel as a "bastion of democracy" has been cruelly squandered by both parties. A reckoning is nigh.
The entire piece is about Israeli strategic interests, not Trump’s personal interests. The “intimate dialogue” is presented as a tool for Israel to obtain security guarantees and military capabilities from the United States. As always, you inject everything with everything you hate about Israel, Netanyahu, and Trump.
The chance of Israel getting any security guarantees from the U.S. or the EU currently is nil. Israel has chosen the stance of the lone wolf pariah nation, and internal dialogue is about Israel delinking from U.S. military aid. The sentiment here in the U.S. concurs.
"A major survey by The New York Times and Siena University reveals growing American opposition to military aid for Israel and military action against Iran. Only 30 percent support war with Iran, while 64 percent oppose it. Most respondents also reject continued US military aid to Israel." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC2q12bBji4
As I mentioned in my post, there is no "intimacy" left between the U.S. and Israel. This is not about my feelings, but about the sentiment of the majority of the American public, especially among younger voters. Wishing it were different is probably not a viable plan forward.
"A pariah is an outcast or someone who is universally despised, avoided, or rejected by society or a specific group. It usually describes a person (nation) who has been shunned due to a scandal, an offense, or a failure to meet community standards."
Here, here!!
B2? Once again I assume you mean B21. There are only 19 B2s, the youngest 30 years old, and all due to be replaced by B21s, of which the US plans to build 150 at least, all capable of dropping the Massive Ordnance Ground Penetrating Bomb,